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Help is solicited in identifying this machine


Sheraz
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About a month back , I bought a gramophone machine in a teak, rectangular shaped box. It’s looks beautiful after I polished it. The box does not have any internal horn inside . There are no holes inside the box to suggest that a horn once rested there. The quality of wood, craftsmanship, the suitcase type lock, escutcheon and the crank tells that it was manufactured by some professional concern. There is no sound box, decal or plate anywhere on the gramophone to suggest it’s make and manufacturer. However the motor is Garrard 30 and Garrard is also engraved at the back of the turntable plate. 
 

I am curious about the it’s origins and absence of the internal horn. I am sure colleagues here would like to offer their expert opinion. 

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Sequel to my last message, I add that I have spotted another gramophone of similar shape and appearance on a Facebook page, introduced as HMV 113 colonial. That one has a HMV 5 A soundbox. The screen shot is attached. Any reflections???

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I am no expert on British machines, but something looks oddly suspicious, starting with the crank and escutcheon.  The crank has too long of a drop requiring placing it near the edge of a table for winding clearance and most machines wind from the side (although, not all).  The tonearm "empties" into the bottom of the case with no apparent exit for sound...  No door or other opening.  Maybe the insides were adapted to an empty case (or wooden box) by someone unfamiliar with phonographs?  Just a guess.  Good luck.

 

The 113 that you pictured, appears to have a drop down front door that hides the horn.

Edited by CurtA
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Something else that is suspicious, is the four extra holes below the escutcheon.345249716_ScreenShot2022-06-27at1_39_47PM.thumb.png.e514da77caddb05978835c5a043f5153.png

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Thanks for your response. It is perplexing to understand why someone built it without a horn. In times when HMV’s colonial models like 113 a, b and 114 were built with commercial ply, a gramophone in teak would have been an expensive proposition. Marketing such an item without an internal horn was definitely an unthinkable option. 
 

You are right the other gramophone seems to have a shutter in the front. 
 

The four tiny holes are actually marks left by the screws of the suitcase type handle, which it is currently under restoration. 
 

Any other expert feedback back ? 

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"The four tiny holes are actually marks left by the screws of the suitcase type handle, which it is currently under restoration."

 

That is another suspicious sign...  It would not be "normal" to have a crank that would interfere with a carrying handle. 
 

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Hi Curt! Very intelligent and smart observations based on logic. Should we conclude that it was some person of good financial means, with poor understanding of technical design requirements, fitted quality leftovers of an English gramophone machine in a Burma teak box for his/her pleasure. Undermining the need of an internal horn or realising his limitations of designing/finding it, he/she accepted the sound coming out of the soundbox. Factually it still produces reasonably good sound.

 

The age of latch, brass corner clips, the carrying handle, wood, nails and screws suggest that the box might have been manufactured sometime around 1950-60s when these things were easily available and used in suit cases.  What reinforces my conclusion about the age is the fact that teak for the last many decades is a scarce type of wood not readily available in timber market.
 

Thanks  for helping me complete  the story board. I will wait for another response on the origin of tone arm and elbow fitted in this gramophone. 

regards

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I am just looking at the case, as it exists today, so my observations are nothing more than guesses based on years of collecting and repairing phonographs.  The case looks beautiful, but doesn't work from a practical viewpoint with the existing setup.  One can only guess what was in the mind of its creator and it may have been left unfinished...  A grill could be fashioned and placed on the back left side of the motor board to allow more sound to escape...

Edited by CurtA
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Sheraz

Hi Curt A

God willing I will take the box to a carpenter and ask him for converting the left side of the box to a drop down window behind which will be a wooden grill supporting a suitable cloth. I will also try to find an internal horn for it. Thanks for sharing your ideas. 
best regards 

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