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Kansas City Stomps - Jelly Roll Morton:1923

Years late I'm afraid but have you seen this?

What an ingenious conversion of an Edison cylinder producer to a disc playing version! Totally bogus, but totally clever at the same time! Yes, the motor and turnatble appears to have some authenticity, but that may be about it.

I wonder about this machine... the horn is obviously from a cylinder phonograph, but the motor and turntable look authentic enough?

Los empresarios Daniel Somers y Henry Davies de la Ansonia Clock Co. firmaron un acuerdo con Edison para la explotación de un reloj parlante que anunciara las horas. Alguien podría proporcionar alguna imagen de estos "relojes parlantes" Entrepreneurs Daniel Somers and Henry Davies of Ansonia Clock Co. signed an agreement with Edison for the exploitation of a talking clock announcing the hours. Someone could provide some picture of these "talking clocks."

I hope this is not going to be another case of an OP asking a question, receiving some earnest attempts at help, and disappearing. Let us know how it's going Bob1. 🙂

It looks like someone fabricated a wooden circle to elevate the tone arm to the proper height. The tonearm looks as if it came from a later style portable phonograph. It was probably used to replace a broken pot metal universal type arm. I do know Sears & Wards offered replacement tonearms in their prewar catalogs. But this is too short for one of those. There were instructions on what to measure from the spindle back to the “horn hole”. This tonearm was probably done in the postwar period, by using what was readily available. “Waste not want not” The great people on this forum can guide you to reputable parts supplier.

#487281 This puts it around 1919. Still a nice example of a VV-X. With the fatter tonearm it can belt out the tunes from the #4 sound box!

I didn’t know we were going to scrutinize my machine? Serial number: 487281

I thought as much. My copy of the data book is upstairs and I failed to check it. If OP would post the serial number we could pin it down more precisely.

That X is much later than a 1913. The Victor-Victrola Page shows it has the attributes of being post 1917. www.victor-victrola.com/X.htm Check the serial number against the database.

This is actually the third iteration of this model. The first being a table top model from 1910, then open leg or spider leg from 1912. You’re Welcome!

Gosh, I didn't realize that VTMCo was using that speed indicator window thingy as early as 1913! IOW, being an early model., your machine still has the original "skinny" arm, too. Thanks for the info on the recording, and thanks for posting!

Actually it’s a Victrola VV-X from 1913. The record is a Victor Batwing of “ Baltimore Buzz “ by Eubie Blake and His Shuffle Along Orchestra : 1921 Paul

I did not want to open the other two cylinders as they appeared to look like they had never been opened, still having the paper type wrap on top of the cotton and folded perfectly. The one that I opened did not have the paper type wrapping on top of the cotton. The Edison cylinders that I found with these were obviously opened and used as some had no cotton, and others were wrapped, but not perfectly like the Bettinis.

Very nice, nipper! Looks like you have a VV-XI of somewhat later vintage than my 1917 model G. Mine still has the original "skinny" tone arm and Exhibition, but I see yours has the "fat" arm, for which the no. 4 is a better match, acoustically speaking. Could you give details about the recording: label, group, title, etc.? Thanks.

To echo Jerry's point, it looks to me as though that Mercury disc is one of the later vinyl 78s, in which case it is totally unsuited to the machine you have, and the disc will be ruined if you play it with that heavy acoustic sound box and steel needle, as pictured. Does your machine display the same symptoms you describe when playing a shellac 78? If so, then I second Jerry's advice about cleaning and lubing the machinery. There are folks who do this servicing professionally, and members here can recommend them, if you have a need. BTW, I lived in New Orleans during my junior high school years, 1953-56, so I know where you are, Bob1. McMain Junior High School, Class of '56. Ah, the memories!

Jerry has offered excellent advice. In addition, I suspect that tone arm is not original to the machine. A good way to evaluate if the tone arm is appropriate for the machine is to see if the needle either can touch the turntable spindle, or at least come close. This tone arm looks too short, and very much resembles components used in portable phonographs of the 1930s/40s. If your tone arm does not touch the turntable spindle, report back and we can recommend a parts supplier who can likely help you. Finally, here's one of the free articles on the APS website which you may find helpful: https://www.antiquephono.org/#/collectiondetails/16 George P.

1. The angle in your 4th photo looks about right. 2. There is supposed to be no resistance/balance within the tone arm. The full weight of the reproducer rides on the record. What you have appears to be correct. Either you're not winding it far enough, or there is an issue with the motor. Possibly weak springs or old, dried-up oil. It could also have to do with the record you're playing which is not really suitable for a phonograph of that era. The compsition of those later discs is not as hard as the shellac discs produced in the 1920's and earlier. This causes drag when played on an early phonograph. Are you using a new needle? Worn needles, (i.e. used more than once), will laso create excessive drag, record wear, and terrible sounds.

How far are you winding it before playing?

This is a 1920's phonograph from Chicago. It plays 78 rpm discs. My wife's grandmother received it as a wedding gift. First 3 photos are overview. There is one thing wrong now. The player used to play normally. Now, it looks like the weight of the reproducer is dragging the record to a stop. I have a few questions to post to the forum (apologies in advance for things that are obvious to APS regulars): 1. When the player is used, is the needle supposed to be perpendicular to the disc? I have been rotating the needle slightly. See 4th photo, this is angle of needle. 2. Is the tone arm and reproducer arm supposed to be balanced to let the needle ride gently on the disc? Now, my reproducer arm flops down with no resistance. I think the set screw has worn through the metal of the reproducer arm. See photos 5, 6, 7, 8. The groove where the set screw tightens to the reproducer arm has lost all of its metal. I don't think the groove should cut all the way through. If a solution is recognized, please advise. The video shows the player rolling to a halt. This is the problem. I have a piece of tape on the swivel to help alleviate the problem. 3. Does anyone remember seeing this reproducer arm for sale on any of the "for sale" parts sites? Thanks. Bob L. Metairie, LA USA 09 rolling to a stop.mp4

Correct. I was hoping that one of those collectors, more informed than myself, might consider that and chime in on the cylinders themselves.