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As others have said, it's neat having a chance to compare the Canadian Berliner with a US Victor. I'm a big fan of the escutcheon they used for the crank and speed control!

I've always loved the Victor III! They're great machines, the perfect blend of size, price and performance in my opinion. When I first started collecting, one of my goals was an external horn disc phonograph. When that time came, I settled on a Victor III. Mine sports the simple black and brass horn, but I've always loved the look of that horn. But your oak horn sure is snazzy, and you certainly can't beat that story.

Yesterday I attended a local annual flea market. Usually the first flea market of the season for me. Normally I never find anything phonograph related but this time it was definitely different. Discovered a box of records with a good batch of acoustic era ones. I’ve had ARTo Phone records before but never in mint condition including the sleeves. This is one of them. Also found a good buy on a VV-VI Victrola. But I left that behind for someone else to discover. Also I already had reached my carrying capability!

A great machine and a great video. Thanks!

Thanks for posting this most informative video! It demonstrates - better than words could - how the Lumiere system works. Impressive! Sound and beauty. George P.

That's remarkable. I've seen photos of similar machines in the past but have never seen (or heard) one in action, so your video was a treat. Such fascinating technology!

WOW! What a beautiful example.

MODEL: HMV 460 Lumiere SERIAL #: YEARS MADE: made october 1924 - november 1925 COST: Oak 22 £, mahogany 25 £ CASE/CABINET SIZE : 17.375 x 11 x 22.375 inch / 441 x 279 x 568 mm TURNTABLE: 12" turntable REPRODUCER: 14" pleated diaphragm MOTOR: Double 11" spring motor HORN DIMENSIONS: 14" pleated diaphragm REPRODUCTION PARTS: none CURRENT VALUE: about 1500 - 2000 euros depending on condition INTERESTING FACTS: Apparently it was invented by Lous Lumière around 1912 – but for some reason never put into production. It is designed for acoustical records – so the timing was really bad when they started production in 1923. It was launched in 1924 – just a year before electric recordings hit the market. It did not fare well – what with the paper diaphragm being utterly fragile to touch and easily broken, the machine is also difficult to manage if you`re not very mechanically minded. You have to know exactly how to adjust the counterweight spring under the diaphragm – otherwise the weight of the diaphragm will ruin records in no time. Apparently this happened a lot and of the 500 or so produced in oak, half of them were returned to His Masters Voice – who then sacked the diaphragm and reconstructed the machine into the HMV 461 – a conventional set-up with an acoustical arm, a long internal horn and the nr. 4 sound box – a machine with excellent sound and apt for electrical recordings. I haven`t the exact numbers, but something similar happened to the 500 or so produced in mahogany. Which left 250 of each or so for the future! I was given one by my father when I was 11 – he called it the Rolls of the gramophones! I really like it for its deco beauty, also it plays really well – especially with fiber needles. Here is a video where you can appreciate the sound quality, also see some of the vital parts of the diaphragm set-up. Lumiere HMV 460.mp4

https://youtu.be/2zH91P63jN4

This is a lot of fun to see. Thanks for the detailed photos. There are so many small differences between the Canadian Berliners and US Victors. Really fascinating.

Even the yoke securing the elbow to the back bracket is different! A very appealing machine. George P.

If you have not noticed, a new forum topic has been added: "Featured Phonographs". https://forum.antiquephono.org/forum/25-featured-phonographs/ Check it out and please enter your own featured phonograph and comment on those already posted. Maybe your favorite machine, or rarest, or with the best "back story", or latest find, or......

MODEL: Berliner KT SERIAL #: 1824 YEARS MADE: ? COST: ? CASE/CABINET SIZE: 11-1/2 W x 11-1/4 Deep TURNTABLE: 7-3/4" dia. REPRODUCER: Exhibition MOTOR: 1 spring HORN DIMENSIONS: 9-1/2" dia REPRODUCTION PARTS: None CURRENT VALUE: INTERESTING FACTS : Basically a Canadian version of the Victor I, but with many subtle but unique features. Notice the striping scheme of the back bracket. The horn elbow, while appearing to be the same as the US verson, has a totally different construction method. The bent part of the elbow is cast brass, while the flare is formed from sheet brass. The two pieces are then brazed/soldered together. You can see the seam in the photos. Notice also the similar but different horn elbow clip and thumbscrew. Eschutcheons for crank and speed control are also uniquely Canadian, as is the nameplate. I bought this at last year's APS Midwest Show. I was taken by it's diminutive size and near perfect condition. (Honestly, the tonearm plating is far better than the pictures suggest.)

Thank you, Rene!

That is such a great story! And the Victor III isn't exactly an eyesore either!!! Thanks for sharing - I especially like the part when it makes it's way through the flood in a garbage bag! A lot of our machines have probably been through very dramatic circumstances - rarely do the stories along their way stick with them! I too remember the strong feelings evoked at the sight of a gramophone at that age!!! I was fortunate enough to sell a very splendid Victor VV-XVIII ( an unusual beast in Europe) to a 12-year old boy who came and bought it along with his supportive parents, for 200$, this was only 2 years ago! His eyes shone!!

Slotted, but it falls off routinely!

My Col. AA came with a reproduction, fall-off crank, (with the spiralled/helical drive slots). The original crank that I located & use is a slotted crank, not a fall-off style, with straight drive slots. Which style is considered correct?

The motor for this toy will be a very hard part to find. You never know where one can turn up. Are the figures original?

Mary, Yes, the reproducer & turntable appear to be correct. However, as you mentioned in your PM, the motors do not. Hopefully, the other small bits will be correct as well.

Actually, I did finally post a listing on uShip. I have used them in the past with decent results. We'll see how it goes.... Fingers crossed. Thanks!

Thanks Mary. Was the lid restored? Can you tell if your cardboard figures are original? There is a hinge in one of your photos on the left side, but can't figure out what that's for. I;m not talking about the hinge for the horn. Would love to see more photos of the rest of the wagon and as Jerry requested, the box of parts. I do see you have the long piece of wood that connects to the start/start lever in the front of the wagon. From what I see, you may be missing the steering wheel as well.

Show us the box of parts. It will help us figure out what you're missing... if anything.

I figured out how to add pictures. this is what I have, along with a box of parts.

the