All Activity

That's a wonderful machine. I wouldn't dream of changing the mandrel. We all have plenty of machines capable of playing 2-minute cylinders. This Gem's history as an ICS-dedicated phonograph is just one thing that makes it very special. Plus, of course, its condition. This is something to treasure and only demonstrate with ICS records. What a stunning and historic phonograph!

Wow. That's a really great story, George! It's incredible that you had a second chance to get the very same machine you had lusted after in your earliest collecting career. I truly feel your pain at having missed it the first time. Been there, done that. My Victor III story is infinitely more mundane. In the summer of 1962 my mother drove me (I was 13) to visit a collector/dealer in Greenfield, MA. He had a mind-boggling collection, with machines stuffed everywhere. I don't remember the details, but somehow I left with a very nice Victor III that cost me all of $8. It had a typical black Victor horn. It was a very welcome addition to my then-small collection. In December of 1962 my father came across a blue morning glory Victor accessory horn in a local antique shop for $1. My parents gave it to me for Christmas, and I immediately put it on the Victor III. I absolutely loved that upgrade. I still have it today, and I take pleasure in the fact that it has become the APS 'mascot,' used on the website and in all sorts of mailings. It really is pretty, and it attracts far more attention among non-collectors than any other machine I have ever owned. Sometimes beauty trumps rarity.

Patrick, I'd be happy to add your Amberola 30 to my list! Would you be willing to share some photos of it? I've been keeping a file of images for each of the machines in my study so I can always refer back to them. I show the movement of the ID plate from the cabinet interior to the rear bedplate occurring somewhere between 56000 and 60000. It moved from the bedplate to the lid between 140773 and 141475. Most sellers of the earlier 30s probably don't know to look in the cabinet for that data plate (or it's poorly photographed) so I have less data on the earlier machines than I do the later ones. I'm recording all the data you mention, with the exception of the ratchet sounding crank. I know that's a feature of the earliest machines, but since I've built my data on old sales listing photos, I haven't been able to ask about that yet, but definitely will note it when I officially start a survey. I can't say I've noticed any other unique features on the earliest machines, but my sample size for them is also quite small. I'd love to get an early 30 myself someday. The only example I own is 226177, in the late style simplified cabinet. The data I've been collecting so far for the Amberola 30 is: Data plate style (Black japanned vs. Brass) Data plate location Pinstripes (Full striping, Edison decal only or none) External Speed control (yes or no) Reproducer set screws (one or two) Reproducer type and finish (Diamond C in nickel or black or Model H) Mandrel shape (flat end or rounded 'bullet' end) Horn guide shape (V-notch, loop or post) Lid support (one or two screw) Motor board screws (flush mounted on the earliest machines or rounded on later) Mandrel (The dull grey end of the mandrel is nickel on some of the last 30s) Cabinet style (I've noted 4 distinct cabinet styles) and cabinet factory number (when possible) I've been collecting the same information for the Amberola 50 and 75, though those models retained the same cabinet style for their production lifetimes (for the most part, the 50 has some special exceptions I plan to post about later).

MODEL: Victor III SERIAL #:13406A YEARS MADE: 1909-1913 COST: $40.00 CASE/CABINET SIZE: 14 1/8" x 14 1/8" x 7 5/16" TURNTABLE: 10" SOUND BOX: Exhibition MOTOR: 2 mainspring HORN DIMENSIONS: No. 31 22" diameter REPRODUCTION PARTS: None CURRENT VALUE: ? INTERESTING FACTS : It seems to me that a “Featured Phonograph” may be a rarity (such as Rene’s beautiful one-of-a-kind Tinfoil machine), a classic which made a significant impact on the early industry, a machine which has descended to its current owner through the family, a common machine with an unusual feature, or any other combination of attributes which might make an instrument appealing. I’ll share one now simply because of the unlikely path it took to my collection. It was the fall of 1970, I was 16 years old, and the Kiwanis Club in my hometown was holding its semi-annual Antique Show in the Armory. I’d been going to these shows for 2 or 3 years; sometimes with my mom, other times with a pal who liked old clocks. This time I was alone, driving with my newly-earned license. The ceiling of the Armory vaulted 30 or 40 feet overhead, allowing gentle sunlight to pass through large glass block windows, and dissipating the crowd noise overhead. I always enjoyed the ambiance of the Armory, and the ~100 dealer booths always held a surprise or two. That morning, I rounded a corner and there it was: the most beautiful talking machine I’d ever seen. Over the past 56 years I remember it as the first wooden phonograph horn I ever encountered. I’m not sure I even knew such horns existed at that point (I’d been collecting for only 3 years). In any event, I was gobsmacked. The dissipated sunlight bathed the machine (an oak Victor) in a golden glow, and my heart was beating a turkey-trot. I had no idea what I was looking at; all I knew in that moment was that I must have this precious artifact. The price tag read $225.00. For a kid who was mowing lawns on weekends and bagging groceries 2 nights a week, it was a fortune. The dealer asked me if I had any questions. I asked if he would accept a combination of cash and trades. At that time I had $50.00-$75.00, an Edison Standard Model B with a flower horn, a small Aeolian-Vocalion, and a Victrola XI I would be willing to trade… My recollection suggests that the dealer was kind, but he wasn’t interested in trading. I did a quick circuit of the show, but I was preoccupied with the vision I had just witnessed. I left the show, jumped in the car, and drove home with the intent to ask my long-suffering father for a loan. Once home, mom reminded me that dad had gone out of town for the day. Mom did nothing with household finances, so I was out of luck. With a heavy heart I returned to the show for no other reason than to gape at the impossible dream. That too would be denied me – the beautiful oak Victor was gone. Two salient points remained with me: the fluted oak corner columns and the spear points on the horn. As the years passed, I learned more, and eventually realized that the machine had been either a Victor II or III, but the spear point horn (a No.31 oak horn) strongly suggested a Victor III. I began attending shows at Union, Illinois and various New Jersey venues in 1980. I saw dozens and dozens of Victor IIIs and No.31 horns over the decades, and occasionally wondered, “Was that you?” Thirty one years after that heartbreaking morning at the Kiwanis Antique Show, I was at work when a colleague (Rich) stopped me. “Hey – I heard that you collect those old phonographs?” I replied that I did. Rich asked, “What would one of those old Victors with a wooden horn be worth?” I smiled and said that it would depend upon the model and of course condition. Rich responded, “Oh, it’s it great condition – I’ve owned it for 30 years.” Suddenly, the dots seemed to be connecting… I asked Rich where he had bought his Victor. “The Kiwanis Antique Show.” A day or two later I drove to Rich’s home and saw the same Victor III that had so entranced me as a teenager. Admittedly, I wasn’t bowled over as I was at age 16. But this time I was able to bring it home. In June 1972, Rich (at left below) had to evacuate his home following the arrival of hurricane Agnes. Below, you can see the wooden horn wrapped in a garbage bag as it's being floated out of harm's way.

I just purchased a Belknap Toy Circus Wagon. It has no working parts inside. I have a box of parts, and some might not be from this machine. I was hoping someone had a working Belknap wagon that could send me pictures of the inside works so I could figure out if I can get it running.

Jerry, Aside from the interesting (and undoubtedly scarce) ICS pulley on that mandrel, the beautiful condition of that Gem makes it a real standout! So that's what they looked like when they left the factory...

Since the serial number falls outside of the range mentioned by George P. in his excellent Gem article published in the June, 2023, edition of "The Antique Phonograph", I assume it may be made as late as 1910, a possibility that George goes on to state in that same article. I'll also note that this example is in pristine condition, leading me to believe that any intended lessons "taught" by this machine did not get very far. Sort of like most treadmills and excercise bikes...

MODEL: GEM, Model C SERIAL #: 309841C YEARS MADE: COST: CASE/CABINET SIZE: TURNTABLE: REPRODUCER: Model C MOTOR: HORN DIMENSIONS: 10" Cone REPRODUCTION PARTS: None CURRENT VALUE: INTERESTING FACTS : Although in many ways just another Model C Gem, except this one was sold as an ICS, (International Correspondence School), machine. To condense the lesson given by a particular cylinder, the playback speed was reduced. Notice the large mandrel pulley meant to change the ratio and therefore the rotational speed of the cylinder. I do not know, however, what the new playback time would be. Three minutes? Four minutes? It also means that standard cylinders will not play at their correct speed. This machine could easily be converted to standard playback by simply swapping out the mandrel with a "normal" one. However, I did not want to change the special nature of this machine. I think it's probably fairly rare as it is, but perhaps not especially valuable.

Great! Had no idea that they were ever striped in that manner. Thanks!

Wow! Thanks Nate for gathering the info, it's really helpful. I'm surprised that the pinstriping lasted as long as it did, up to around serial 11,000 – I was expecting it to be in the under-1,000 range. Are there any other differences for the first-out-of-the-factory units that you've noticed? When did the ID plate move from the interior adjacent to the front grill? And the horn U-mount changed at some point as well early on. Here're some notes of early differences that I've been capturing: Ratchet sounding crank Horn front mount ('U' slot vs 'post/horn hole') Pinstriping on gear cover and bedplate: Under serial 11,0000 Edison signature on rear bedplate Exposed speed control through gear cover Data plate position (interior adjacent to horn, bedplate rear, inside front side lid) Reproducer retaining screw(s): one vs. two Reproducer: nickel finish vs black finish If you're still collecting data, I can forward details from mine (3-digital serial in the 700s).. Thanks again for tracking the data! Patrick

George, the Edison signature decal appears in the open space behind the mandrel (where the data plate later was placed). It seems that Edison discontinued the full pinstriping but continued to apply just the signature for some time after. It's something I need to look into further. Unfortunately, the way I've collected data thus far makes it difficult to see the signature, since it's often not photographed clearly. I've attached an image of my fully striped Amberola 50 to demonstrate where the signature was placed.

Good luck with your search. I'm sure one will turn up. I found a couple of them. I have two A-150s. It took me awhile but eventually got them. Depending on whether your A-150 is the slightly later one with "tone modifying ball" you might need one without a damper. I guess they could be ordered both ways.

Fantastic information, Nate. Thanks for sharing that.

Great information, Nate! The Edison signature decal you mention: where was this located? George P.

For some time I've worked on collecting data on the Amberola 30/50/75, just by perusing auction sites and other online images. I'd eventually planned to open the survey to other contributions with the hope of writing a study on the 30, but I've always been better at starting projects than I have been at actually finishing them. My Amberola 30 spreadsheet currently contains data on 435 examples. As you said, these are common machines, but excellent workhorses and deserving of study. For what it's worth, I can provide some answers to your queries. The full pinstriping was the first thing done away with, sometime before serial number 11000. The Edison signature decal lingered for some time later. The highest serial number I've seen with that decal was just over 63000, but that also seems to be an outlier. The earlier machines are harder to collect data on, because the data plate is located in the horn compartment and most sellers don't bother (or know) to photograph it. The exposed speed control seems to have stopped a bit before serial number 71000. However, it can be found sprinkled throughout the run of the Amberola 30, since they were available as ICS machines with a special Model H reproducer instead of the usual Diamond C. The highest serial number I'm 100% confident had an exposed speed control is in the 194000 range, as it is equipped with the ICS Model H reproducer. I also have exposed speed controls in the 204000 and 224000 serial number blocks, but I’m less certain of their authenticity. The late style plain cabinet you mention shows up around serial number 200000. Interestingly, somewhere between 227000 and 228000, Edison actually reverted to the previous cabinet style with base molding and that "fancier" cabinet was standard for (most) of the rest of the run. The lowest serial number I have seen is 243, and the highest serial number is 235322.

No, I haven't. I've owned many tinfoil phonographs over the years, both originals and replicas, but this is one of only two that I decided were simply too delicate to take that risk. As beautiful as the lacey castings are, they are very fragile. (The other phonograph was a small machine by Vital, made of wood with a plaster of Paris mandrel. Less delicate than this one, but still ridiculously fragile.)

Wow! You've certainly started this off with a real jewel! Have you ever attempted to record & play back with it?

I can only guess that Allen came up with the Poole attribution because of Read's alleged New Jersey origin. (Poole was based in Newark.) Poole did make at least one sample machine for Edison but I've found no evidence that any were actually sold to the Edison Speaking Phonograph Company. There are some pictures of this machine (taken by Edison's nephew Charlie) but they show a heavy and industrial beast, not remotely like the delicate craftsman machine featured here.

What a wonderful example of an early Tinfoil Phonograph! A great start to this category. We included an image of this machine in our first book, The Talking Machine Compendium. At the time, Allen told us that it might possibly be the work of Alex Pool, but again - no hard documentation. George P.

Okay, I'm happy to start what I hope will become a very active series of threads. This is probably the rarest machine I have ever owned: MODEL: Tinfoil SERIAL #: None YEARS MADE: circa 1878 COST: unknown CASE/CABINET SIZE: 13" x 10" TURNTABLE: --- REPRODUCER: combination recorder/reproducer MOTOR: hand-powered HORN DIMENSIONS: none REPRODUCTION PARTS: none CURRENT VALUE: Anyone's guess INTERESTING FACTS : This early tinfoil phonograph was first discovered by Oliver Read sometime in the 1930s in the northeastern United States. Read is best known as the co-author (with Walter Welch) of the seminal book "From Tinfoil to Stereo," first published in 1959. Unfortunately nothing is known about its maker. It was evidently made in the US, in violation of Edison's patents, as is evident from the non-metric hardware. The metal castings are very ornate and quite complicated, which would lead me to believe that more than one would have been produced in order to amortize the foundry costs, but no others are reported to survive. The machine is illustrated on page 21 of the early editions of "From Tinfoil to Stereo." Read's caption suggests it was made by "an independent maker in New Jersey" but he offers no evidence for the assertion. Read kept the machine in his collection until the late 1970s or early 1980s, when he sold it (along with several other phonographs) to the late collector Allen Koenigsberg. I acquired it from Allen about 20 years ago. In addition to highly ornate castings, the wooden base has elaborate carvings, some highlighted with gilt, and inlaid marquetry. There is a small hidden drawer in the back to hold spare stylii and other supplies. I first saw this machine on Christmas day, 1962, when my parents gave me a copy of FTTS. I was enchanted, but I could never have imagined that several decades later it would highlight my own collection.

Featured Phonograph TEMPLATE GUIDE MODEL: SERIAL #: YEARS MADE: COST: CASE/CABINET SIZE: TURNTABLE: REPRODUCER: MOTOR: HORN DIMENSIONS: REPRODUCTION PARTS: CURRENT VALUE: INTERESTING FACTS :

You're right. It's a Union No. 1. No, I haven't found one that's complete in good condition yet.

Have you tried UShip.com? I've had great luck finding people with space on a load who delivered to my door for low cost. That's how I got an Edison Schubert from a ranch in Texas.

Sort of off-topic, but maybe of some interest, there's an 8-4 (http://www.victor-victrola.com/8-4.htm) at the top left of that Facebook page. It appears to have a brass sound box (nine holes). At $150, the price seems right.

That's a fun idea! Phono of the week, a sort of spinn off from the featured phonographs that used to be on the TMF, which I really enjoyed back in the day! Extra interesting machines for whatever reason...