Jump to content

Interesting Violin-like Reproducer Horn Combo


Recommended Posts

I wanted to share an interesting Reproducer / Horn setup from my collection.   It is reminiscent of the Le Palmodian Gramophone from France that uses a tuned violin as the reproducer and horn.  The needle is on the bottom of the instrument and it causes it to vibrate and project the sound.  

What I have is similar in design but is not an actual violin and does not have strings.  It is much smaller, and it is made of carved maple and spruce with F holes on the top.  There is an adjustable gutta percha post on the underside that fits onto and adjustable stand to allow use on different machines.  It has the ability to hold the horn up to change the needle.    There is a metal needle holder, and  it also has a small grill on the end sound. 

I have not been able to find any maker’s name or markings on it.  It certainly seems to be commercially made.  I also have not seen any documentation of it before or any ads for it. 

I have it installed on a Zon-O-Phone parlor and it has a good proportion for this machine, and it works well with it.  The sound is mellow and rich but lacks a bright high-end sound, as you would expect.  I would consider this to be the most unique wooden horn for a phonograph that I have seen. 

I had a particular interest in this as both of my daughters are Violinists.  I would love documentation of this piece from anyone that can help.  Copies of ads, other examples etc. 

Gregg

15378cvt.jpg

15379cvt.jpg

15382cvt.jpg

15384cvt.jpg

15386cvtb.jpg

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

What an interesting device!  As you note, the influence of the Palmodian is obvious, but this accessory wouldn't require purchasing a new machine.  For recorded-music lovers living in cities or other crowded conditions, the advantages would be obvious; certainly better than putting a sock into a conventional horn!

 

I suspect it's European, but I've never seen anything quite like it either.

 

Thanks for sharing this, Gregg!

 

George P.

Link to post
Share on other sites

As sometimes happens, something in the back of my mind kept whispering that I'd seen something like this.  Well, after an hour or two it hit me.  Here's an article in the German trade magazine, Phonographische Zeitschrift, dated August 14, 1901:

 

zeit1.jpg.16fd4cee242a5401a63be84e729c7d6a.jpg

 

I don't speak German, but maybe someone can offer a translation...?

 

Perhaps more helpful is this advertisement placed in the September 11, 1901 issue, which specifies that the device was adaptable to Phonographs, Zonophones, and Gramophones:

 

zeit2.jpg.e6491ec8b2c46f8148382b491c88d0ed.jpg

 

I hope this helps throw a bit of light on Gregg's curious device.

 

George P.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Very interesting indeed.  I'm not sure I would even have recognized it as a phono related item if I were to stumble across it in an antique shop.

Link to post
Share on other sites

A respondent on the Talking Machine Forum discovered a couple of articles about the "Fullertone," a device that, from its written description, certainly sounds like Gregg's artifact.  From the January 1922 issue of The Talking Machine World:

 

Fullertone1.thumb.jpeg.e78d3d237123a8bbcbd6b22023fe64eb.jpeg

 

Fullertone2.jpeg.aac3000a7458accebc2bf7c29e956904.jpeg

 

This article is from the February 1922 issue:

 

Fullertone3.jpeg.b74b903bb4cc67e24c6584b3507d365c.jpeg

The man behind the development of the "Fullertone," Antol Fodor, filed for a Danish patent on July 7, 1922 on a device called a "Speaking Machine."  The patent was granted on February 4, 1924.  I have been unable to locate the patent drawings, so whether this was the device being publicized as the "Fullertone," or Gregg's device remains uncertain.

 

George P.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Given the description of it in the article, I have no doubt that it, is describing what I have.  The Greek lyre shape resembling a violin in construction and finish...  what I find particularly curious is that it is from 1922!  The stand was missing when I got it, and I constructed what I thought appropriate to make it usable and had a good aesthetic for displaying assuming it from the early 1900’s.   The patent drawings would be particularly helpful regarding this.  

Link to post
Share on other sites

As requested, here are the translations of the two German articles above. Interestingly, the first article talks only about cylinders, while the smaller add also includes Zonophones and Gramophones. 

 

Andreas

 

 

Sound-amplifier for music-phonographs

By John Kock, Altona-Ottensen, Bahrenfelderstrasse 15.

We have taken the following from the flyer about this notable new device:

The reproduction of vocal and instrumental pieces by the apparatus is not even remotely matched by any other so far commercially available sound-horn. The so far funnel-like and un-perfect reproduction of vocal and instrumental pieces happens through the new apparatus in such natural, louder, and more beautiful manner, that everyone who so far has been demonstrated this apparatus was actually amazed by the clarity and fullness of tone. Many stated that one believes to have a whole musical ensemble in front of themselves, and all that with the use of a phonograph with small cylinders. The apparatus is suitable for any system, both for small and for large Concert cylinders.

The apparatus consists of the actual resonance-body made from the finest resonating materials (especially impregnated American oak wood), within the body is a separating wall made from the same material; a removable brass-horn connected to a rubber hose fitting any diaphragm is connected to the body. All that rests on a turn-able and adjustable lacquered iron arm; a string or brass chain with rings for fixating the adjustable body completes the assembly resting on a solid oak pillar and a wrought iron footing.

 

NEW!

Sound-Amplifier

For

Phonographs, Zonophone and Gramophone.

Is offered in 4 price categories;

Surpassed in natural reproduction of tone everyone else so far!

One can order price-lists and descriptions free and postage-paid.

John Kock,

Altona-Ottensen.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I found a Swiss patent using google patents that sounds like it is what I have (copy below).   it is translated from German.  The horn has an angled piece of wood inside creating two chambers.  Unfortunately, the diagram referenced in the patent document is missing.  Does anyone know how to go about asking for a copy of this patent from the Swiss patent office?  

 

CH107661A

Switzerland

Inventor: Fodor Antal

 

Means for improving the sound of reproduced by a phonograph music.

 

Claims (1)

Hide Dependent

PATENT CLAIM: Device for improving the sound of the pieces of music played back by a phonograph, characterized by an instrument that forms a whole, which consists of a resonance body with a vibrating organ, one with. there is two connected needle holder with a playing needle and a support device, said connection being made so that the sound, like a violin, is amplified by the resonance of the resonance body and the air contained therein. SUBCLAIMS: 1.

Device according to patent claim, characterized in that the vibrating element is a partition dividing the resonance body in the form of a box into two spaces of unequal size. 2. Device according to patent claim, characterized in that the vibrating organ is a box which divides the resonance body into two unequal spaces in the resonance body. 3rd

Device according to claim and dependent claim 1, characterized in that the connection between the resonance body and vibrating organ on the one hand and the needle holder on the other hand is made in such a way that on the one hand a rod connected to the vibrating organ is firmly connected to the needle holder and on the other hand a rod is inserted into the needle holder - The last pin is inserted into a retaining plate fixed to the resonance body. 4th

Device according to patent claim, characterized in that the support device has a sleeve placed on a mandrel, in which the resonance body is rotatably supported by means of a pin, a joint being switched on between the resonance body and the pin, which is inserted when the device is used It is allowed to fix the resonance body in a swung position.

Description

  Device for improving the sound of the music pieces played back by a phonograph. - The present invention relates to a device for improving the sound of the pieces of music played by a phonograph and has a whole bil Dendes instrument, which consists of a resonance body with a vibrating organ, one with two connected needle holder with playing needle and a support device, whereby the said connection is made in such a way that the sound waves, similar to a violin, be amplified by the resonance of the resonance body and the air in it. 

In the drawing, the subject invention is illustrated in several embodiments, for example. 

Fig. 1 is a plan view of the on the record of a phonograph on the instrument, with the sound box is partially broken away; Fig. 2 shows a modified execute approximate form of the resonance body; Fig. 3 is an enlarged vertical section of the brought into working position Resonance body according to Fig. 1; Fig. 4 is a section through a support device, and Fig. 5 is such a needle holder.    

 

 

 

  On the circuit board 2 of a Phonograph 1, which is equipped with scale 3 for setting the running speed and with brake lever 4, a resonance body 5 equipped with sound holes 6 in the manner of a violin is placed. In the execute approximate form according to FIGS. 1 and 3 forms a weak, made about hardwood scabbard wall '7, a vibrating organ inserted into the resonance body. This wall is inclined and touches the walls of the resonance body, the space of which is thus divided into two unequal-sized compartments.

    The end 10 ′, bent at right angles, of a rod 10, which is firmly connected to a needle holder 12, rests in a bearing 9 that is firmly seated on this partition. In this, the game needle 13 is set on the underside and a spring pin 11, which is supported against a pin 14, which is adjustably held by an adjusting screw 17 in a bore 15 of a holding plate 16 on the top. This holding plate is firmly screwed to the sound box, and rod 10 passes through a hole 18 in the holding plate and sound box bottom in the nere of this body. 

The support device according to FIG. 3 consists of a sleeve 25 fitted onto a split mandrel 24, which has a bore 26 with an extension 27 and a sleeve 28 fitted into this extension. The mandrel sits on a base plate 23, and in the sleeve 28 a means of a head screw 30 secured pin 29 with a conical head 31 is inserted, which is connected by a hinge to the resonance body. The part 35 seated on this body is cut out beyond the hinge pin 34, so that the resonance body in the position indicated by dash-dotted lines, illustrating a non-use position, is located on a holding pin 33 provided in the pin 29 and is secured in its position. 

 In FIG. 2, the vibrating element, instead of being a partition, is a second box 8 which divides the interior of the resonance body into two spaces of unequal size and which is connected to the needle holder in the same way as the wall in FIG. 1. 

The embodiments of the support device and shown in Fig. 4 and 5. Needle holding devices differ from the devices already described in that, according to FIG. 4, the pin 36, which is also provided with a conical head 37, carries a holding pin 39 resting on a spring 40, and that the pin with the holding plate firmly seated on the resonance body 41 connecting joint 38 has a groove 43 interrupted at 42 for the retaining pin, so that the resonance body is fixed in the working position and the non-use position. 

The needle holder according to FIG. 5 also occurs if through a hole 21 in the holding plate 19 and the bottom of the resonance body in the interior of this body. The held by the holding plate 19 spring pin 20 but is slanted through a cylindrical neck of the rod 10 and thus rigidly connected to this rod. 

Both the spring pin 33 in the execute approximately form according to Eig. 3, as well as the spring pin 20 according to FIG. 5, are intended to ensure the greatest freedom from vibrations for both the rod 11_I and the resonance body, since the vibrations conveyed by the needle 13 are transmitted as precisely as possible, what, how Tests have shown that it is better achieved here than by any universal joint.

Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Lioret said:

I used my digital kitchen scale to measure the weight....  126 G!  Ouch!

 

Ouch is right!  Probably not something you'd want to play your N- discs with then.  4  1/2 ounces 

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/10/2020 at 5:01 PM, Lioret said:

I found a Swiss patent using google patents that sounds like it is what I have (copy below).   it is translated from German.  The horn has an angled piece of wood inside creating two chambers.  Unfortunately, the diagram referenced in the patent document is missing.  Does anyone know how to go about asking for a copy of this patent from the Swiss patent office?  

 

Here it is.

 

Fodor 2.png

Fodor 1.png

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 6 months later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...